@ Neetu....thanks a lot for replying :)
yea..i was looking for smaller I-banks as you mentioned.....how can I get to those guys?....linkedin doesn't even work on my pc...damnit! :evil: im handicapped!
what do I do?
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@ Neetu....thanks a lot for replying :)
yea..i was looking for smaller I-banks as you mentioned.....how can I get to those guys?....linkedin doesn't even work on my pc...damnit! :evil: im handicapped!
what do I do?
Quote:
Originally Posted by time4apogee
I understand your situation and mostly agree with Neetu.
CFA Level 1 won't guarantee you a good finance job. So I don't think you should leave Patni unless you have an alternate offer.
There are 2 paths possible if you don't get a core ibanking job now:
1. Get into an analytics firm like Evalueserve and try to do investment research, financial modeling etc.
2. Try to get a job in derivative trading firms like Futures First.
I know that Indian IT companies usually give really stupid work and so you don't want to join Patni. But you may join it and try to get some experience of the software industry. Later you can use this experience and combine it with an MBA or CFA to become an equity research analyst for technology stocks.
@ Sougata:
yea..I was considering firms like Futures First....but I suppose they recruit from top-notch colleges...wud I stand a change ?......and in case of evalueserve...I looked it up ....what skills do firms like these look for?...i can start working on that from now.....
in fact, if someone out here has worked at Futures first, please pitch in.
@ Kumar Ganesha:
Thanks for the reply! :)
Well, I'm looking at Corporate Finance/M&A rather than Equity Research....but yes, I can be more sector specific(IT) in my role while I apply to I-banks. Now Patni has a 2 yr bond..So if I do end up joining them, I might as well complete all the 3 CFA levels by the end of those two years. But the question is: what kind of work ex will I be getting in 2 years out there? ..I have a sibling who works in a top MNC in the Banking and Capital Markets Domain...u hardly get to learn anything about finance....its core software stuff that they do.....at least initially!...they do have domain training...ive seen the stuff...but its nothing compared to what I'll be learning through CFA....So then how wud the IT job help?...I would in face spend more of my time learning software stuff which I don't intend to...and I'm afraid it might eat into my CFA prep, especially when I reach Level 2 and 3....maybe 3-4 years of IT work ex might help bcuz by then I'll be into some sort of project mangement and will get some client exposure and will also be following market trends by then....but waiting that long would be a punishement! :mrgreen: ....That leaves me still confused :? .....Your take on it?
Hi,
I have worked in Futures First and it was a good experience. The timing can be a little odd and the work can be a bit stressful. But you'll enjoy it and you'll learn derivatives trading.
They have recruited off-campus from non-IITs and you can check if they are recruiting currently or not.
- Neetu
Hi Neetu,
what's their criteria of selection?....and they have an aptitude test i suppose....what's that like?
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------Quote:
Originally Posted by time4apogee
I was not aware of the 2 year bond that Patni has imposed. It's sad that these companies use such tactics to retain employees. They are sure that the work is so bad that no one will like to stay even for 2 years. :D
I will suggest that you start applying to other IT companies that don't have this bond. It'll be easier for you to get an IT job compared to a finance job. But once you get through Level 1 and have some finance knowledge, the chances of getting a decent finance job will also improve. Right now you may not get the really good finance jobs. They'll involve back office work and you won't like that.
When do you have to join Patni? How many months are remaining?
Th Patni bond has another clause...I've got to deposit 75k while joining them,which I'll receive along with accrued interest at the end of the two year period.
They said in August...so if they are to be believed I've got 4 months to go! :twisted:
Quote:
Originally Posted by time4apogee
The main criteria for selection is the ability to crunch numbers very fast. They have a test were they'll give you simple maths question like 33.5X17.8 or 105/13 etc. You'll have to come up with the answers fast because it's like a competitive test. In a short time, who ever gets the max no. of correct answers goes to the next round.
So basically they'll test your quantitative aptitude and analytical skills.
- Neetu
@Neetu:
do they ask only calculation intensive questions like the ones you mentioned or even conceptual ones?
The selection procedure for Futures First is:
Written Test
First round has 30-40 simple maths calculations to be done in 6 min. Speed is key.
Second round is an aptitude test were 20-30 questions are to be completed in 30 min.
Interview
Generally two rounds of interview. They can ask about finance industry, derivatives, Futures First, trading etc. It can be a stress interview and they can start grilling on any topic.
They currently have an opening in the Research Department for the position of a Research Analyst.
The job description will be: -
1. Preparation of reports, Technical & Fundamental.
2. Be a knowledge base for the branch and the organization.
3. Training.
5. Knowledge development.
7. Regular interaction with traders.
8. Contribution towards the growth of the organization.
The vacancy is specifically for energy markets and hence people with relevant experience will be preferred. FF is located in Noida, Jaipur, Kolkata , Hyderabad, Bangalore & Gandhinagar. This job will be in Gurgaon.
Thanks Neetu! :)
Well, how do i find out current opening like you just mentioned?...Their careers page does not inform me regarding the same. In fact, even the location is not mentioned.
I got it from the following link:
http://www.futuresfirst.in/ExperiencedHires.aspx
Thanks! :)
From this discussion, I feel that getting into a big investment bank like Goldman Sachs or JP Morgan would be tough. So may be we can try for smaller investment banks in India. Does anyone know some of these boutique investment banks in India?
Yes Nidhi. My plan was to get into smaller investment banks.
I found the following list of small size investment banks in India:
http://www.allegroadvisors.com
http://www.uniconindia.in/
http://www.sparkcapital.in/
http://www.avendus.com/
http://www.indusview.com
http://www.o3capital.com/
Thanks Lalit. Do inform us about any openings in the future.
Thanks Lalit.
Even Evalueserve seems to be a decent place to start a career. After learning some financial modeling/investment research it might be possible to shift to big investment banks.
Evalueserve is a KPO right?....why are people admonished from entering KPO's??.....some people use the term "captive" KPO's....can somebody throw some light on it..
Hi,
There is good news. NOMURA which is one of the world leading finance service company has very large number of good openings (like Investment Banking-Operations/Finance, Risk Mgmt, Equity credit research,..etc). So, you can try your luck at http://www.naukri.com/nomura/
Parwindar Kaur
Thank you Parwindar.
@time4apogee
I don't think KPOs are inherently bad. They may be a good place to start learning. However you'll not want to stay in that KPO for a long time. For e.g. you can start as an analyst and jump to an ibank as an Associate.
Captive KPOs work for that co. only. So McKinsey Knowledge center is a captive KPO for Mckinsey and serves it. However Evalueserve is a general KPO can serve different clients.
dear time4apogee
usually Kpo & investment banks hire engineers fresher for working on database softwares like SQl,SAS ,cognos etc or doing Modelling on EXCEL VB.
U can do one thing learn SQl, ,EXCEL VB ,increase ur knowledge of Finance .Dont panic ,make a planned strategy ,acquire knowledge make urself competent enough to enter in Investment bank as they attract finest talent.
Hi satyamgairola,
Could you elucidate on the SQL, Excel VB thing......I also read about quants working on C++....what's with the programming thing in I-banking?....Initially i thought mainstream finance would give me freedom from Programming and CSE :D ...but doesn't seem like :|
could you list a few good sources to learn this stuff (things more specific to the job)...i saw some stuff on finance3.0....actually i havent worked on excel b4 but i know i have to learn it....so where do i begin?
@ Nidhi,
Thanks for explaining!
@ Parwindar,
You think Nomura would even look at my CV?? :D ....They are recruiting engineers with some finance qualification and 1-10 yrs work ex....had this been one yr later I wud have been a perfect fit for it assuming that I was a CFA L2 candidate by then.....hope such opportunities come my way when they matters the most :)
Could you elucidate on the SQL, Excel VB thing......I also read about quants working on C++....what's with the programming thing in I-banking?....Initially i thought mainstream finance would give me freedom from Programming and CSE ...but doesn't seem like
could you list a few good sources to learn this stuff (things more specific to the job)...i saw some stuff on finance3.0....actually i havent worked on excel b4 but i know i have to learn it....so where do i begin
Dear friend,
Usually companies have to work on lot of data like million of files so they Use softwares like SQL.I will be sending book on sql on ur mail id
While working on Excel u have to do some repetitive assignment ,than u use EXCEL VB for runing macros which saves ur time.
U can learn Excel by parctice only brother,there are some very good books on EXCEL and EXCEL VB uploaded on finance 3.0.
Regarding programming in Investment Banking i have uploaded a part of paper presentation by Mark Joshi
Quote:
Originally Posted by time4apogee
I'm PMed you here on DG...could you please check it and reply....
Ill wait for ur mail...also,could you be specific in mentioning the names of excel and excel VB books
SQL isn't tough right?.. I studied basics of it two years back...but that was real basics...creating tables, retrieving basic data and stuff :P ....simple basics!...don't know if that even counts as 'acquaintance with sql' :D
If you do an MBA in Finance, then you'll not be learning the C or MATLAB programming. However if you are doing a Masters in Math Finance, then you'll learn the programming stuff to create quantitative models. These finanl models can be for option pricing or pricing some complex derivatives like CDOs etc.
oh ok!....well, i dont wanna get into that....wanted to get into the managerial aspect of things....ive got very strong presentation and communication skills....im sure ill do very well on the front end....i like M&A/PE, etc....so wanted to get into such kinda stuff.....and im sure once i get in ill do well....hopefully CFA should help me get a few calls and considering my other abilities i should make it somewhere...
what exactly do analysts in M&A do?......i know that they make do excel modeling, create pitchbooks, etc and even get a chance to pitch for deals after working for a while .....anything else?
Hi,
Analysts spend most of their time with Excel. They are involved in the following activities:
Prepare complex financial analyses and models
Conduct due diligence investigations of client companies
Support the preparation of detailed pitch book and presentations describing the key attributes of client companies
Research potential buyers/investors and
Participate in various marketing and recruiting activities of the firm
Naveen
Thanks, Naveen.
Well, what do u mean by 'analysts participate in recruitment activities of the firm'?
I mean they help senior managers arrange career fairs and help in recruiting interns etc.
There are some administrative work that the analysts do to help the senior members of the team.
Naveen
ok!:)
Can anyone tell me what exactly is the role of a credit analyst? What skills do I need to get such a job?
Credit Analyst help organizations assess and control credit risk. For e.g. banks might need an analyst to judge the credit risk of loans. The Analyst may do the following:
Hi Guys !!
I stumbled upon this site today and I must admit that the forums, the discussions and so on are really interesting and informative. And obviously, the "I-Banking after Engineering" had my immediate attention.
I say obviously, because, like most of us here, I am an engineer. I am a BE in Electrical and Electronics from Manipal Institute of Technology(MIT), Manipal University (2009 Passout). Although I have always been interested in Finance, Investment Banking to be specific, I could never really get a break in Finance. I currently work in a Technology Consultancy company, and to be honest, I hate my job.
To my credit, I am a Certified Professional in Finance, a Certified Professional in Portfolio Management and a Certified Professional in Derivatives & Risk Management from the New York Institute of Finance. In addition to these, I also have Certificates in more than 15 modules from NYIF, covering the entire Finance domain. I have also completed a couple of NCFM modules, but don't really think that they really help.
Despite my domain knowledge in Finance, I currently do not work in a domain where I can leverage these skills and knowledge. I plan to take the CFA Level 1 this december, but I am still apprehensive about it. Reasons:
1. Cost (I have to finance myself)
2. Time and devotion (my current job does not let me have personal time)
3. Most importantly, having gone through various posts, i am still not sure if this CFA level 1 examination could help me in the immediate future.
Also, I plan to do an MBA after maybe 4-5 years of experience, and feel that an MBA would really help me, and give my career a boost, if I was already in the Finance domain. So, to summarize, i want to get a Finance job (read: IB) before an MBA. I am trying my best to develop a profile which is best suited to a finance job, but, I have had no success till now. CFA level 1 could be a solution, or maybe an MSc in Finance from a reputed International University.
The only reason I wrote all this is, because I fell that there are quite a lot of people with a similar dilemma/problem, and there are also quite a lot of people in this forum who can guide us. Although, i have gone through every post, I feel it would be wonderful if any one of you could suggest/share anything that could help me. Thanks!!
Hi Atul,
Welcome to the forum. Many of us are in the same boat.
The reasons that you have mentioned for your apprehension are valid and most people think in the same way. I'll like to address those issues.
1. Cost (I have to finance myself)
The level 1 is a little more costly due to the registration fees. But if you can get a finance job, then this investment will be worth the time and money. If you complete at least 2 levels, then you'll surely get a job.
2. Time and devotion (my current job does not let me have personal time)
This is something you have to work out. Depending on your priorities. You'll also have to sacrifice some weekend parties, movies etc. :D
3. Most importantly, having gone through various posts, i am still not sure if this CFA level 1 examination could help me in the immediate future.
CFA Level 1 may not get you a job immediately but the CFA charter is very prestigious and in the long run be great for your career. So I am not sure about the short-term but it will be a competitive advantage even if you go for an MBA.
Naveen
Thanks for grt reply.
But do you feel that a person with IT background (3+ years) can also land into Finance Job (in India) after completing CFA L2? :?
I am sure the first question from the interviewer will be why finance from IT. :D
it gr8 to see more IT guys trying to get into finance. Let's keep this thread alive to help each other out! :D
@ optimistical: i think that question can be handled 8-)
@ atul: u have so many certifications. i have not heard of the first few, but if they r really valuable then why don't you go out and try for a job..you might get in, given your inclination towards finance. Secondly, CFA will definitely help. I think you should go ahead with it.
@ time4apogee : Man this is India. You have to get an MBA to enter into IB's.
At the same time I think that CFA might change this culture as our ecomony is growing but with other certificates I am completely hopeless. :(
One more interesting point for you. This is what stat says: IT guys are more inclined towards finance than the guys who are already working in Finance because we IT guys know what the Whole IT is all abt! :D
I hope you agree.